Manchester - city and town planning gone wrong!

I went to Manchester at the weekend. Yeah, I agree that it is becoming a major league dump! The crazy wall in picadilly gardens, I could hardly believe it when I saw it. That stupid fountain and the worn out bits of grass, it looks like a waste ground. It was so hot in the streets and no shade because most of the streets dont have any trees. And everything is way over-priced there too.

I went to Manchester bout 2 weeks ago. A complete dump! I've never seen so many scallys around, and yeah, it is so grey that's like a dumping ground.

Miserablemoaninggit

I agree partly with you but how recent and how much of the centre of Manchester are you referring to?

In one way it would be 100% agreeable but widening the radius and time span I could only agree with you about 70%.

Still I agree with you where your views are based on the centre.

The Walkie Talkie, yes, but my comments about Manchester were also made within the context of recent, new, development - with lots of money pouring into the city centre. In other words, what a waste! Do you agree with my comments in this context (about the centre of the centre)?

Miserablemoaninggit

I know you were talking about the centre of Manchester but was trying to point out there are some attractive buildings as well as ugly ones and this holds all over.
My reference to Blackpool, Preston, Coventry and Milton Keynes were in response to others comments about these places as I am familiar with all and what I was saying about them was what I said about Manchester.

I don't know of any town or city that doesn't have this contrast or is purely one without the other.

Let us have your views on other towns and cities.

The Walkie Talkie, what you say does, of course, make perfect sense. I was talking, I suppose, very much about the 'centre of the centre' of Manchester - the main shopping areas, Piccadilly Gardens etc. In other words, the main area that most 'day visitors' to Manchester will see. There are, of course, the odd exception in that area. The Cathedral is one of them. But, generally speaking, my points still stand - especially about the 'horror' that is ther redevelopment of Piccadilly Gardens.

I have lived in Coventry and Blackpool and now live near to Preston and teach in Manchester.

They all have their grey concrete images in dull weather but there are some very nice places in all of them.

Hillfields, Wood End are not too good in Coventry (I lived in Hillfields) but there has been a lot of development in other areas. Some of the older areas have some heritage about them like Spon End.

Mereside and Grange Park as well as parts of Layton and near the centre of Blackpool are rather run down but Marton, Bispham and Squires Gate are quite nice as are other parts. I could quote one street I think looks a bit intimidating but that would be unfair.

The Callon estate and areas around New Hall Lane in Preston are a bit rough but other parts of the city are quite nice. There are grey areas but that doesn't affect how I feel.

Last but not least, Manchester has its good sides as well as its bad sides. The centre has come a long way like its neighbour Salford with development of the Lowry and Salford Quays. There are some rough areas like Moss Side, Longsight and other areas around the city but as with any city you have the industrial and rougher communities and also the nicer ones. A lot of buildings in Manchester are not "gloomy grey".

To sum up they all have their good sides and bad sides but I have never felt they are worthy of being gloomy capitals. They all have something different.

Unless you live in a wealthy area take a look along some streets nearby and you are likely to see some tacky or gloomy grey buildings nearby - some of them have some history behind them. You can sometimes be more welcome in what appears to be rough areas as there is often more community spirit in some.

By the way Milton Keynes has its unusuality too with all the roundabouts and concrete buildings but that is different too. Have any of you looked at Milton Keynes Village nearby? It all adds to the variety in life.

DeeEm, Yes, I can accept that other people have a different view, although I ask for some examples of the 'beautiful urban environment'. Certainly, there will be some beautiful buildings e.g. Manchester Town Hall is great to look at. However, taken as a 'whole', Manchester comes across as 'grim' and 'grey'. Also, I don't think we should underestimate the need for more open green spaces; the lack of green spaces is extremely significant in impacting upon the beauty of a city, and the well-being of the people who have to live there (in the city centre itself). And finally, any city planner that plans upon plonking a great big, grey, concrete wall right in Picaddilly Gardens may as well put up a hugle invitation sign to the urinators and the graffiti 'artists' (not much impressive by way of 'art' from what I've seen). So, a lack of planning in that there was a lack of commonsense. No offense DeeEm, but you seem to be speaking from a position of sentiment, rather than an evidential basis.

I couldn't think you were more wrong about Manchester. I think it's a beautiful urban environment, full of character. I'm always shocked when people say they don't like it, and invariably they come round to it after spending time there. It could do with more green spaces but it's definitely got charm as opposed to say Milton Keynes. And to blame city planners for the graffiti and the urine... wouldn't it make more sense to blame the graffiti artists and the urinators?

I've stayed in Blackpool twice a year, for a week at Easter and in October, since 1985. Don't ask. It's a sad place, with little or no real investment. Hopeful little new shops/cafes open at Easter only to be closed by October. The seafront and surrounding area is tacky and whiffs of chips and lager. Shopping, generally, is dismal. Sorry, but that's how it is. Things do get better away from the prom. Sad town. I felt sorry for them when they didn't win the super casino.

Yeah, like I said, Coventry is a real dump too. Somehow though, Manchester just feels real dirty, and miserablemoaninggit is right when he says its full of grey and there are no green spaces. At least in Cov the memorial park is within walking distance. The pavements aren't so full of chewing gum stains and it just doesnt feel as grotty and miserable as Manchester does. Even the trams in Manchester look dull! Where is the colour? And Picadilly Gardens needs to be wiped out and redesigned again cos it is a disaster to look at. What a dump!

@INCov - Coventry isn't as bad as Manchester? Is this a joke?!
A badly planned ring road system, old fashioned dirty subways, a s^#t hole of a town centre full of cavs.
Coventry, a badly planned town.

Who says that I aint looked at my own town? Coventry is another example of a real dump too but it aint as bad as Manchester

InCov - are you from Coventry (InCov)??
If so, I suggest you look at your own town before even commenting on Manchester.

Manchester planning gone wrong? Visit Preston, now that's a town which is just wrong.

Manchester is a real dump. The place is full of dirt, litter and chewing gum stains all over the pavements. I went there a couple of weekends ago and saw plastic urinal things near that horrible concrete wall for people to have a piss in and everybody would be able to see them. I could hardly believe it. What a real dump! In some places, they planted crappy little trees in pots that have just become big ashtrays for the chuffers to dump their cancer stubs. And that Arndale centre? The IRA could have done a better job at blowing that load of crap up!

Blackpool's really nice, at least quite a few parts of the town centre and along the seafront are. Now lets compare Blackpool (or Manchester) with a place like Milton Keynes and you'll REALLY see a drab soulless place.

Some parts are ok, but that horrible concrete wall in Piccadilly Gardens reminds me of someting from East Germany , and it is a graffiti magnet. Plus if you lived in one of the new flats I am sure it would really screw you up.

Mallory, LOL, I haven't been to Blackpool for many years. Is it really that awful? I suppose every city/town centre is relative to another, but as a major city in England, Manchester does seem particularly bad in planning just for 'shops' and 'business', and neglecting the needs of people, particularly residents, who need some relief from the 'concrete' and the greyness. It seems like the basics have been neglected that could have easily been ensured, particularly with the amount of money that has poured into Manchester over the years. Like, as I've stated in my gripe, Piccadilly Gardens. It is central to the city centre itself, and yet has been designed with no obvious focal point (a more 'traditional' fountain would have been great) and a bleak, grey wall that is almost totally absent in any aesthetic appeal (except for the grey, wall lovers who love the smell of urine). My sympathies about Blackpool though. Last time I went, I remember lots of peope getting drunk, swearing, wearing football shirts and eating chips.
Hale Preston, I must confess that I have never been to Preston.

Or head past Preston to the shores of Blackpool, my old hometown...Manchester is a lush green paradise in comparison!