Speaking in a foreign language to exclude others
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We’ve got quite a melting pot of different ethnic groups here in the United Kingdom. However, our primary language as spoken by the vast majority of people is still English as far as I am aware. |
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I can fully appreciate that foreign visitors cannot be expected to speak the language, after all I can’t speak Spanish and I have visited Spanish owned islands on many an occasion. I do try to make an effort and learn a few phrases though. It takes time to learn English and as long the people who have moved to this country at least make the effort, I have no problem with that either. Language used to cloak their conversation |
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However I take great offence when people use their native tongue to cloak their conversation in the presence of others who do not share their language. It is just plain rude and quite unacceptable, particularly so when they were speaking English perfectly well just before you walked into the room. I’m not trying to be funny, or racist. But if you want to have a private conversation, go somewhere private and have it. Don’t use your language to exclude those around you, as it is extremely anti-social. |
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Comments from visitors
I am an Northern/Eastern European myself and when talking in a company consisting not just of my country men but of English colleagues as well I switch to English because it merely polite for they taking part in conversation as well and it is UK here. However, when I am talking to my friend (s) and the conversation is just between us you cannot expect me to talk to my best mate who is from my country in English just because we are in a public place or at workplace. It does not make sense. When I talk to English person I talk in English (Standard), but when I talk to my mum I will of course talk in Latvian, it is just normal. I remember I once sitting in pub garden when my mum called on my mobile and I was having a conversation with her when suddenly some British Asian man, obvious bigot, jumped up and started to be offensive to me implying that I disrespecting him. I was so shocked that jumped up (scared the crap out of him) and told to go and f...k himself and next time when I see him talking to his Asian mum in Punjabi or whatever I am going to give a kick under his smelly ass and send him back to Pakistan. I know I lost it but I was more then sure that the ass would not have anything against me if I was talking very loudly in one of Asian languages. Bigot and twat he was.
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What is so wrong about spesking me own langage? I dont have to speek English just because innit.
Lertza ungash nay dorgun, dargan se munish sar englis. Pa sgar yat?!
Lertza ungash nay dorgun, dargan se munish sar englis. Pa sgar yat?!
-9
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Oh god! We are so like the French about language. Should holiday travellers coming to the UK not speak their own mother tongue for fear of offending a Brit?
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This kind of language exclusion/rudeness does happen and there's no need to deny it. It's behind closed doors language brought out into the open, but it's near impossible to prove. You could brandish a recording device when it happens ("Oh I keep forgetting to switch this recorder off."), and mention that your sister's colleague is "insert nationality here". That might calm things a lot. Another good thing to do is to actually learn a bit of the language and use it with them. That dampens the enthusiasm considerably because it's not possible to know what people will and won't pick up once they start learning a language. And who knows, it might make you some new friends.
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I have to admit to being a bit surprised that that comment made it through the automated censorship. Everybody is so sensitive about anything that may sound slightly racist nowadays.
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old but still grumpy - 24-Oct-10 10:35
When people who speak a language other than english into mobile phones, why do they have to shout very, very, very, very, quite extremely very loudly?
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old but still grumpy - 24-Oct-10 10:32
"Don?t use your language to exclude those around you, as it is extremely anti-social."Does this man live on planet earth?
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Neilyn, my mother tongue is English and to me Welsh is a foreign language that I do not speak. When I have been in Wales however I have not expected local folk to speak English, neither have I been offended when local folk have conversed in their native tongue in my presence. If I were in France I would similarly take it as a matter of course that the locals would speak French. However, speaking to a companion in a language that they understand is not deference, it is common sense. Perhaps I have been lucky in that all of my Welsh friends and acquaintances have been able to speak English and were happy to do so, to me at least. The point that you make is right, if it is that one should not expect others to speak amongst themselves other than in their mother tongue.
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Welsh, of course, is not a foreign language. It is the native language of Wales, and apparently the oldest of all languages in Britain.
Welsh speaking people speak Welsh to each other precisely because that is what they are used to.
It would be the height of bad manners/arrogance/pig ignorance to EXPECT Welsh speaking people to ALWAYS defer to English when in the company of people who are not Welsh speaking.
I would venture that few bilingual individuals who speak a language other than English as their mother tongue would disagree with that statement.
Evidently, there will be some individuals who, for reasons evident only to one's imagination, will disagree.
Welsh speaking people speak Welsh to each other precisely because that is what they are used to.
It would be the height of bad manners/arrogance/pig ignorance to EXPECT Welsh speaking people to ALWAYS defer to English when in the company of people who are not Welsh speaking.
I would venture that few bilingual individuals who speak a language other than English as their mother tongue would disagree with that statement.
Evidently, there will be some individuals who, for reasons evident only to one's imagination, will disagree.
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English is the best languague ever.....But it would be a great gift to speak in many tongues..
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Autumn Sunset - 31-Aug-10 11:16
Has anyone ever been to a Welsh speaking area of Wales? if Welsh speakers know that you don't understand the Welsh language, they just love using the Welsh language to speak about non-welsh speakers.
I think that speaking in a language that even one person in a group does not understand is the hight of bad manners and ignorance.
I can accept that there are some cases where people who do not have a good grasp of English to use their "Native" language to explain something to each other that they may not understand or cannot pronounce in English.
But lets face it, there are almost no "Natives" in Wales who cannot speak or understand English (except by choice) so WHY? do they need to speak in Welsh when in the company of Non- Welsh speakers? In this case it is just PIG ignorance as far as I am concerned.
I think that speaking in a language that even one person in a group does not understand is the hight of bad manners and ignorance.
I can accept that there are some cases where people who do not have a good grasp of English to use their "Native" language to explain something to each other that they may not understand or cannot pronounce in English.
But lets face it, there are almost no "Natives" in Wales who cannot speak or understand English (except by choice) so WHY? do they need to speak in Welsh when in the company of Non- Welsh speakers? In this case it is just PIG ignorance as far as I am concerned.
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that was probably some eastern european language not "dialect". I am just wondering if you any less rude then they are, or you just an ignorant... You know eastern europeans having their own LANGUAGES not like you dialects only... enough to switch on television, pure spoken english... hehehe. and for your information they are entitled to speak whatever language they want despite you around or not. any doubt? check in citizen advise bureau. I did. It my be a bit rude to other people around not understanding this particular language I agree, but compering to personal culture (farting, burping, disrespecting forein people) I am faceing every single day at work that is just nothing. Anyway they probably were speaking about some more complicated things then fish and chips or weather, so I don't think you could be interested in... Best regards
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What about the English peoples that don't even bother asking if the person they talk to in a foreign country speaks English before starting talking straight in English. That's rude to and it doesn't shows a lot of social skills. At least try to speak one or two sentence in the language of the country you visit, even if it's just to say hello and ask if they speak english...
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Adapt to the culture hosting you. When in China my host beams with pride when I belch at the table. Back home, my wife is less amused.
It's simple common sense. If you can speak the common language of the culture you're in, and choose to speak a foreign tongue, in the presence of those not able to understand you, it is rude and disrespectful. Offenders don't have to agree with the etiquette of the culture they visit, but they really ought to abide by and respect it.
It's simple common sense. If you can speak the common language of the culture you're in, and choose to speak a foreign tongue, in the presence of those not able to understand you, it is rude and disrespectful. Offenders don't have to agree with the etiquette of the culture they visit, but they really ought to abide by and respect it.
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Chris - yes, Britain is only 40 km away but we're talking about the sea, not just a short trip by road. I think the reason we don't have French, Dutch or German TV here is because it's rubbish. The BBC, on the other hand, produces some excellent programmes.
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Brits in Wales watch Sianel4Cymru in Welsh and Brits in Scotland watch BBC Alba in Gaelic.
Which Brits struggling to speak anything but English are you talking about? The ones in England perhaps?
Which Brits struggling to speak anything but English are you talking about? The ones in England perhaps?
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Why is there no free to view foreign channels in Britain?
Britain is only 40km from the coast of Europe but yet you can't even find one French, Dutch, German, Italian or Spanish television on freeview. What's up with that? I'm sure if you go to Europe you can always find BBC, CNN or at least one English channel yet Britain doesn't bother having any free foreign channels.That might also explain why Brits struggle speaking anything but English.
Britain is only 40km from the coast of Europe but yet you can't even find one French, Dutch, German, Italian or Spanish television on freeview. What's up with that? I'm sure if you go to Europe you can always find BBC, CNN or at least one English channel yet Britain doesn't bother having any free foreign channels.That might also explain why Brits struggle speaking anything but English.
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"The Welsh do switch back to Welsh from English when they know that someone from England is listening and I've encountered it several times in shops and pubs in North Wales. Other nationalities certainly do the same but sadly, in my own experience the Welsh manage to make a point of being rude to the English."
Am be goblyn ti'n siarad? Tydi'r Cymry BYTH yn newid o'r Saesneg i'r Gymraeg pan fo rhywun o Loegr yn gwrando. BYTH!
Am be goblyn ti'n siarad? Tydi'r Cymry BYTH yn newid o'r Saesneg i'r Gymraeg pan fo rhywun o Loegr yn gwrando. BYTH!
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I hope to speak english fluintly someday in my life
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The Welsh do switch back to Welsh from English when they know that someone from England is listening and I've encountered it several times in shops and pubs in North Wales. Other nationalities certainly do the same but sadly, in my own experience the Welsh manage to make a point of being rude to the English.
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